---

1) "Open Source" - så er kildekoden åben, men programmet er ikke
nødvendigvis gratis?

2) Må man med "Open Source" selv ændre et program og så sælge det i eget
navn?


mvh Jakob

---

"JN" <jakob@putandtake.dk> writes:

> 1) "Open Source" - så er kildekoden åben, men programmet er ikke
> nødvendigvis gratis?

Normalt, ja. Afhænger dog af det enkelte program og dets licens.

> 2) Må man med "Open Source" selv ændre et program og så sælge det i eget
> navn?

Normalt, ja. Afhænger dog af det enkelte program og dets licens.

--
Jens Kristian Søgaard, Mermaid Consulting ApS,
jens@mermaidconsulting.dk,
http://www.mermaidconsulting.com/

---

Jens Kristian Søgaard wrote:

> "JN" <jakob@putandtake.dk> writes:

>> 2) Må man med "Open Source" selv ændre et program og så sælge det i eget
>> navn?

> Normalt, ja. Afhænger dog af det enkelte program og dets licens.

Der er jeg uenig, _normalt_ mår man ændre i det og udgive det selv, men ikke
tage penge for det. I hver fald ikke i følge den meget udbredde GPL licens.

Men som du siger, så afhænger det at licensen.

--
Greetings
Bjarke Freund-Hansen

---

Bjarke Freund-Hansen <RoceKiller@impsoft.dk> writes:

> Der er jeg uenig, _normalt_ mår man ændre i det og udgive det selv, men ikke
> tage penge for det. I hver fald ikke i følge den meget udbredde GPL licens.

Ehm, hvor pokker står det så henne i GPL-licensen?

Du må da gerne tage penge for programmet - du skal bare være villig
til at udlevere kildekoden.

--
Jens Kristian Søgaard, Mermaid Consulting ApS,
jens@mermaidconsulting.dk,
http://www.mermaidconsulting.com/

---

Jens Kristian Søgaard wrote:

> Bjarke Freund-Hansen <RoceKiller@impsoft.dk> writes:

>> Der er jeg uenig, _normalt_ mår man ændre i det og udgive det selv, men ikke
>> tage penge for det. I hver fald ikke i følge den meget udbredde GPL licens.

> Ehm, hvor pokker står det så henne i GPL-licensen?

> Du må da gerne tage penge for programmet - du skal bare være villig
> til at udlevere kildekoden.

Jeg har ikke læst licensen, men mener dog rimlig sikkert at man ikke må tage
penge for selv programmet, men dog godt for at lægge det på CD, for en
manual man evt. har skrevet til det, osv. for andre udgifter, men ikke for
selve programmet.

Men som sagt jeg har ikke læst den, så jeg kan godt tage fejl.

--
Greetings
Bjarke Freund-Hansen

---

Den 28 Aug 2002 17:24:58 GMT skrev Bjarke Freund-Hansen:
>Jens Kristian Søgaard wrote:
>
>> Bjarke Freund-Hansen <RoceKiller@impsoft.dk> writes:
>
>>> Der er jeg uenig, _normalt_ mår man ændre i det og udgive det selv, men ikke
>>> tage penge for det. I hver fald ikke i følge den meget udbredde GPL licens.
>
>> Ehm, hvor pokker står det så henne i GPL-licensen?
>
>> Du må da gerne tage penge for programmet - du skal bare være villig
>> til at udlevere kildekoden.
>
>Jeg har ikke læst licensen, men mener dog rimlig sikkert at man ikke må tage
>penge for selv programmet, men dog godt for at lægge det på CD, for en
>manual man evt. har skrevet til det, osv. for andre udgifter, men ikke for
>selve programmet.

Nej, du må tage lige så mange penge for programmet som du har lyst til,
om så du vil have en million for det. Sourcen skal bare være med i
prisen uanset hvad du sætter den til (for at folk ikke skal sælge
programmet billigt, og forlange en million for sourcen), og dem du
sælger det til, må ligeledes gøre som de har lyst til.

Mvh
Kent
--
NT er brugervenligt - det er bare brugerne der ikke kan finde ud af det
- en NT-administrator

---

Jens Kristian Søgaard wrote:
> Bjarke Freund-Hansen <RoceKiller@impsoft.dk> writes:
>
>
>>Der er jeg uenig, _normalt_ mår man ændre i det og udgive det selv, men ikke
>>tage penge for det. I hver fald ikke i følge den meget udbredde GPL licens.
>
>
> Ehm, hvor pokker står det så henne i GPL-licensen?

Det gør det heller ikke. Du må gøre præcis hvad du vil med GPL software
bare du giver folk præcis de samme rettigheder til software som du selv
fik da du modtag det når du videre distribuerer det.
Inkl. retten til at modificere og videredistribuere. - gerne for en pris.

.... kort fortalt.

---

Peter Mogensen wrote:

> Jens Kristian Søgaard wrote:

>> Bjarke Freund-Hansen <RoceKiller@impsoft.dk> writes:

>>> Der er jeg uenig, _normalt_ mår man ændre i det og udgive det selv, men ikke
>>> tage penge for det. I hver fald ikke i følge den meget udbredde GPL licens.

>> Ehm, hvor pokker står det så henne i GPL-licensen?

> Det gør det heller ikke. Du må gøre præcis hvad du vil med GPL software
> bare du giver folk præcis de samme rettigheder til software som du selv
> fik da du modtag det når du videre distribuerer det.
> Inkl. retten til at modificere og videredistribuere. - gerne for en pris.

Jamen så undskylder jeg misinformationen, var bare helt overbevist. ;)

> ... kort fortalt.

Fino.

--
Greetings
Bjarke Freund-Hansen

---

Peter Mogensen <apm-at-mutex-dot-dk@nospam.no> writes:

> > Ehm, hvor pokker står det så henne i GPL-licensen?

> Det gør det heller ikke.

Lad lige være med at vold-quote

> Du må gøre præcis hvad du vil med GPL
> software
> bare du giver folk præcis de samme rettigheder til software

Nej, man må ikke gøre præcis, hvad man vil.

Du må f.eks. ikke tage en anden mands GPL-program, fjerne hans navn
fra copyrighten og videreudgive det under eget navn.

--
Jens Kristian Søgaard, Mermaid Consulting ApS,
jens@mermaidconsulting.dk,
http://www.mermaidconsulting.com/

---

Jens Kristian Søgaard wrote:
> Nej, man må ikke gøre præcis, hvad man vil.
>
> Du må f.eks. ikke tage en anden mands GPL-program, fjerne hans navn
> fra copyrighten og videreudgive det under eget navn.

Det har egentlig ikke noget med GPL licensen at gøre ... det er alm.
copyright lovgivning.

Men ja... ligepræcis det må man ikke gøre.

Peter

---

Peter Mogensen wrote in <3D6D17F2.7040701@nospam.no>:
>> Nej, man må ikke gøre præcis, hvad man vil.
>>
>> Du må f.eks. ikke tage en anden mands GPL-program, fjerne hans navn
>> fra copyrighten og videreudgive det under eget navn.

Det har jeg ellers fået at vide engang at man gerne må.

> Det har egentlig ikke noget med GPL licensen at gøre ... det er alm.
> copyright lovgivning.

Loven om ophavsret gælder mig bekendt kun hvis andet ikke er angivet.
Skriver man, at folk må kopiere det alt hvad man vil, kan man ikke bagefter
tæske folk med loven om ophavsret.
Ligesådan mener jeg ikke at loven om ophavsret gælder, hvis man fraskriver
sig rettighederne ved at bruge en licens som GPL.

Men jeg har heller ikke læst GPL, og jeg er heller ikke jurist.
Men jeg har hørt en hulens masse tolkninger af mange dele af GPL'en, og jeg
har hørt mange gange, at man gerne må ændre navnet, men at det et moralsk
forkert. Dette er første gang jeg har hørt, at man ikke må.

--
Mvh.

Niels Andersen
Linux 2.4.18 - Debian testing/unstable

---

Den Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:03:05 +0200 skrev Niels Andersen:
>Peter Mogensen wrote in <3D6D17F2.7040701@nospam.no>:
>>> Nej, man må ikke gøre præcis, hvad man vil.
>>>
>>> Du må f.eks. ikke tage en anden mands GPL-program, fjerne hans navn
>>> fra copyrighten og videreudgive det under eget navn.
>
>Det har jeg ellers fået at vide engang at man gerne må.
>
>> Det har egentlig ikke noget med GPL licensen at gøre ... det er alm.
>> copyright lovgivning.
>
>Loven om ophavsret gælder mig bekendt kun hvis andet ikke er angivet.
>Skriver man, at folk må kopiere det alt hvad man vil, kan man ikke bagefter
>tæske folk med loven om ophavsret.
>Ligesådan mener jeg ikke at loven om ophavsret gælder, hvis man fraskriver
>sig rettighederne ved at bruge en licens som GPL.
>
>Men jeg har heller ikke læst GPL, og jeg er heller ikke jurist.
>Men jeg har hørt en hulens masse tolkninger af mange dele af GPL'en, og jeg
>har hørt mange gange, at man gerne må ændre navnet, men at det et moralsk
>forkert. Dette er første gang jeg har hørt, at man ikke må.

Jeg kan ikke lige huske om det direkte står i GPL, men du må kunne bruge
denne:

§ 3. Ophavsmanden har krav på at blive navngivet i overensstemmelse med,
hvad god skik kræver, såvel på eksemplarer af værket som når dette gøres
tilgængeligt for almenheden.

Stk. 3. Sin ret efter denne paragraf kan ophavsmanden ikke frafalde,
medmindre det gælder en efter art og omfang afgrænset brug af værket.

Fra http://www.copydan.dk/index.asp?FE_ID=1&ML_ID=38

Mvh
Kent
--
If I wanted a blue screen, I would type "xsetroot -solid blue"
- not D:\WINNT\SETUP

---

Niels Andersen wrote:
> Det har jeg ellers fået at vide engang at man gerne må.

Vedkommende tog fejl... GPL er ikke public domain.

> Loven om ophavsret gælder mig bekendt kun hvis andet ikke er angivet.
> Skriver man, at folk må kopiere det alt hvad man vil, kan man ikke bagefter
> tæske folk med loven om ophavsret.
> Ligesådan mener jeg ikke at loven om ophavsret gælder, hvis man fraskriver
> sig rettighederne ved at bruge en licens som GPL.

Det gør man heller ikke. Folk beholder ophavsretten til den kode de
skriver. GPL software er copyrighted software.
Ophavsret siger ikke nogen om hvor meget andre må kopiere.

> Men jeg har heller ikke læst GPL, og jeg er heller ikke jurist.
> Men jeg har hørt en hulens masse tolkninger af mange dele af GPL'en, og jeg
> har hørt mange gange, at man gerne må ændre navnet, men at det et moralsk
> forkert. Dette er første gang jeg har hørt, at man ikke må.

Det er nok det der er problemet. Der er flere der fortolker GPL end folk
der ret faktisk læser den.

For almen oplysnings skyld, så er den her:

-----------------------------------------------------------------



       GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE
       Version 2, June 1991

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---

Niels Andersen <niels-usenet@myplace.dk> writes:

> Men jeg har heller ikke læst GPL

Prøv det.

--
Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen
http://unixsnedkeren.dk - Unix, Java, Web, Netværk, Århus

---

Niels Andersen <niels-usenet@myplace.dk> writes:

> Peter Mogensen wrote in <3D6D17F2.7040701@nospam.no>:
>>> Nej, man må ikke gøre præcis, hvad man vil.
>>>
>>> Du må f.eks. ikke tage en anden mands GPL-program, fjerne hans navn
>>> fra copyrighten og videreudgive det under eget navn.
>
> Det har jeg ellers fået at vide engang at man gerne må.

Det er forkert. Læs §3 stk. 3 i Lov om ophavsret:

§ 3. Ophavsmanden har krav på at blive navngivet i overensstemmelse
med, hvad god skik kræver, såvel på eksemplarer af værket som når
dette gøres tilgængeligt for almenheden. [..]

Stk. 3. Sin ret efter denne paragraf kan ophavsmanden ikke
frafalde, medmindre det gælder en efter art og omfang afgrænset brug
af værket.

Selv om man ønskede det, *kan* man ikke fraskrive sig ret til at blive
krediteret.

> Ligesådan mener jeg ikke at loven om ophavsret gælder, hvis man
> fraskriver sig rettighederne ved at bruge en licens som GPL.

Forkert. Man afskriver sig ikke sine rettigheder med GPL. GPL er en
kontrakt, hvor man giver brugeren visse rettigheder på betingelse af at
de opfylder kravene i GPL.

Grunden til at GPL virker er *netop* ophavsret.

> Men jeg har heller ikke læst GPL,

Du har ikke overvejet, at det ville være en fordel, når du udtaler dig
om hvad den går ud på?

---

Du kan læse den "officielle" definition af open source her:


http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php

Peter

---

JN wrote:

> 1) "Open Source" - så er kildekoden åben, men programmet er ikke
> nødvendigvis gratis?

Nja. Principielt er det rigtigt, men da open source stiller det krav, at
hvis man først har købt en kopi, så kan man videredistribuere den, er det
i praksis det samme som at open source programmer er gratis.

Der er firmaer, der udgiver deres programbiblioteker som open source, og
som lever af at tage sig betalt for at fritage deres kunder for forplig-
telsen til selv af åbne deres kildekode. Troll Tech, der har lavet Qt
biblioteket som ligger under KDE desktoppen er et eksempel på det.


> 2) Må man med "Open Source" selv ændre et program og så sælge det i eget
> navn?

Ja. Du behøves ikke en gang at ændre det, men du skal levere source koden
med og du skal give dine kunder samme rettigheder, som du selv har. Dvs.
at de må lave samme nummer og sælge programmet under deres eget navn.

-Claus

---

Claus Rasmussen wrote:
> Der er firmaer, der udgiver deres programbiblioteker som open source, og
> som lever af at tage sig betalt for at fritage deres kunder for forplig-
> telsen til selv af åbne deres kildekode. Troll Tech, der har lavet Qt
> biblioteket som ligger under KDE desktoppen er et eksempel på det.

Namesys der laver ReiserFS er et andet.
Men det kan de kun fordi de holder copyrighten til koden.
Bemærk at hvis du vil bidrage med en patch til den officielle ReiserFS
skal du overdrage copyrighten til Hans Reiser (fra Namesys) - ellers
kunne de ikke gøre det.

Peter